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	<title>Comments for History Into Fiction</title>
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	<description>The Writer's Craft of Recreating the Past in Novels and Movies</description>
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		<title>Comment on Rabasa&#8217;s Rules for the Literary Researcher by Wendy Bertsch</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2010/08/rabasas-rules-for-the-literary-researcher/comment-page-1/#comment-718</link>
		<dc:creator>Wendy Bertsch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Aug 2010 15:54:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/?p=209#comment-718</guid>
		<description>Thank you!
I&#039;m in the research stage of a new book revolving around a real character from the 17th century, and have an obsessive fear of being caught out in some small error. I worry that this will hamper my ability to shape an effective plot.
You&#039;ve encouraged me to ease up a bit and allow myself to create a great story around the few known facts, Fortunately there&#039;s a lot of &#039;gray area&#039; to work with. 

Wendy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you!<br />
I&#8217;m in the research stage of a new book revolving around a real character from the 17th century, and have an obsessive fear of being caught out in some small error. I worry that this will hamper my ability to shape an effective plot.<br />
You&#8217;ve encouraged me to ease up a bit and allow myself to create a great story around the few known facts, Fortunately there&#8217;s a lot of &#8216;gray area&#8217; to work with. </p>
<p>Wendy</p>
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		<title>Comment on Rabasa&#8217;s Rules for the Literary Researcher by Dave McGowan</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2010/08/rabasas-rules-for-the-literary-researcher/comment-page-1/#comment-668</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave McGowan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 16:14:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/?p=209#comment-668</guid>
		<description>Great advice!
In &#039;Partners&#039; I moved the assasination of Police Constable Jack Lawton a few weeks so that it would fit in with my story. In &#039;Homesteader&#039; I moved a stage coach robbery a few weeks for the same reason.
Most people - even those who read Canadian history - didn&#039;t know that those two events happened, never mind when. And historical facts helped to entertain, even when the timing was changed slightly.
Dave
www.dmmcgowan.blogspot.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great advice!<br />
In &#8216;Partners&#8217; I moved the assasination of Police Constable Jack Lawton a few weeks so that it would fit in with my story. In &#8216;Homesteader&#8217; I moved a stage coach robbery a few weeks for the same reason.<br />
Most people &#8211; even those who read Canadian history &#8211; didn&#8217;t know that those two events happened, never mind when. And historical facts helped to entertain, even when the timing was changed slightly.<br />
Dave<br />
<a href="http://www.dmmcgowan.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.dmmcgowan.blogspot.com</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on Rabasa&#8217;s Rules for the Literary Researcher by George Rabasa</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2010/08/rabasas-rules-for-the-literary-researcher/comment-page-1/#comment-667</link>
		<dc:creator>George Rabasa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 15:12:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/?p=209#comment-667</guid>
		<description>Glad some of my comments made sense to you. One point I like to make, and which often gets me into trouble, is that all good fiction is &quot;historical&quot; fiction the year after it&#039;s been published. That is, it reflects its time and freezes the moment for future readers. John Irving&#039;s &quot;World According to Garp,&quot; John Updike&#039;s &quot;Rabbit Run,&quot; Don Delillo&#039;s &quot;White Noise&quot; are examples that leap to mind. On the other hand, few genres beat the thrill of the time travel that true historical fiction offers, and the light of understanding it can often shed on the present moment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glad some of my comments made sense to you. One point I like to make, and which often gets me into trouble, is that all good fiction is &#8220;historical&#8221; fiction the year after it&#8217;s been published. That is, it reflects its time and freezes the moment for future readers. John Irving&#8217;s &#8220;World According to Garp,&#8221; John Updike&#8217;s &#8220;Rabbit Run,&#8221; Don Delillo&#8217;s &#8220;White Noise&#8221; are examples that leap to mind. On the other hand, few genres beat the thrill of the time travel that true historical fiction offers, and the light of understanding it can often shed on the present moment.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Quote of the Day: Verisimilitude, not Accuracy by Richard Warren Field</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2010/05/quote-of-the-day-verisimilitude-not-accuracy/comment-page-1/#comment-641</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Warren Field</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 May 2010 03:32:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/?p=180#comment-641</guid>
		<description>Primary sources have also been known to exaggerate the facts. Some of the troop numbers quoted in primary sources over a number of eras have strained credulity. And as we look at current events, how many times do we hear the statement: &quot;history will be the judge?&quot; It is a tricky business, figuring out just what the &quot;truth&quot; was. That&#039;s what makes this type of writing endlessly fascinating. I just ask writers to be up front about what they have invented - without ANY sources!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Primary sources have also been known to exaggerate the facts. Some of the troop numbers quoted in primary sources over a number of eras have strained credulity. And as we look at current events, how many times do we hear the statement: &#8220;history will be the judge?&#8221; It is a tricky business, figuring out just what the &#8220;truth&#8221; was. That&#8217;s what makes this type of writing endlessly fascinating. I just ask writers to be up front about what they have invented &#8211; without ANY sources!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Viral Marketing and Historical Fiction by Al</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2010/02/viral-marketing-and-historical-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-540</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 05:00:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/?p=86#comment-540</guid>
		<description>What a great thing to ponder. How would Salinger fare now?
Probably not to well. But then...Al

&lt;a href=&quot;http://publish--or--perish.blogspot.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Publish or Perish&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What a great thing to ponder. How would Salinger fare now?<br />
Probably not to well. But then&#8230;Al</p>
<p><a href="http://publish--or--perish.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">Publish or Perish</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on Frost/Nixon and the Subjectiveness of History by CL</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2009/02/frostnixon-and-the-subjectiveness-of-history/comment-page-1/#comment-515</link>
		<dc:creator>CL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Feb 2010 19:22:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/2009/02/frostnixon-and-the-subjectiveness-of-history/#comment-515</guid>
		<description>A year late-but thanks for this thoughtful post.  While not being in total agreement, I can understand Morgan&#039;s cynicism on this point.  Anyone who reads enough historical non-fiction should become aware that not only are the large over-arching theories usually disputed among experts, even basic facts often are as well.  What IS a fiction writer or dramatist to do when faced with two, three, or more versions of events?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A year late-but thanks for this thoughtful post.  While not being in total agreement, I can understand Morgan&#8217;s cynicism on this point.  Anyone who reads enough historical non-fiction should become aware that not only are the large over-arching theories usually disputed among experts, even basic facts often are as well.  What IS a fiction writer or dramatist to do when faced with two, three, or more versions of events?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Exposing History&#8217;s Cracks in Logic by D.A. Riser</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2009/03/exposing-historys-cracks-in-logic/comment-page-1/#comment-465</link>
		<dc:creator>D.A. Riser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 01:58:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/2009/03/exposing-historys-cracks-in-logic/#comment-465</guid>
		<description>I think it is up to the writer to decide what is more important - the truth or the story. Hopefully, both can be given their equal due, but if story prevails, historical authors who note their discrepancies at the end win my forgiveness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it is up to the writer to decide what is more important &#8211; the truth or the story. Hopefully, both can be given their equal due, but if story prevails, historical authors who note their discrepancies at the end win my forgiveness.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Germaine Greer and the Historical Novel by Melisende</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2009/02/germaine-greer-and-the-historical-novel/comment-page-1/#comment-463</link>
		<dc:creator>Melisende</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Mar 2009 05:58:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/2009/02/germaine-greer-and-the-historical-novel/#comment-463</guid>
		<description>I personally think she is past her &quot;use by&quot; date.  Her opinions of late seem to be a little &quot;off kilter&quot; and as a reference or even &quot;authority&quot;, she would not be my first choice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I personally think she is past her &#8220;use by&#8221; date.  Her opinions of late seem to be a little &#8220;off kilter&#8221; and as a reference or even &#8220;authority&#8221;, she would not be my first choice.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Frost/Nixon and the Subjectiveness of History by Harlan Lewin</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2009/02/frostnixon-and-the-subjectiveness-of-history/comment-page-1/#comment-460</link>
		<dc:creator>Harlan Lewin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Mar 2009 04:27:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/2009/02/frostnixon-and-the-subjectiveness-of-history/#comment-460</guid>
		<description>I was captured by the alleged quote by Peter Morgan, &quot;what a complete farce history is.&quot; 

I know how people use the word &quot;farce&quot; cynically; I hear it every day. They use it to say, &quot;there is no such thing as truth.&quot; Which means, I can do anything, say anything I want to and if I have the power to control the channels of media, it becomes &quot;truth.&quot; Plato had a good time with this in one of his dialogues.
But, it seems to me, it is more true that Morgan&#039;s play and the movie based on it were more accurately farces. 
Webster&#039;s definition of a farce is: to improve as if by stuffing. 
Now, Morgan says he cut the parade of jelly-like facts down to the bone. But I would argue he in fact stuffed history with a bunch of crap. The person I was with, for example, walked out of the movie asking, &quot;What was that girl (Frost&#039;s friend) there for? She never did anything.&quot; She was, in fact, a very large bit of well-stuffed stuffing in the form of eye-candy to get some better ratings. 

But (and I know I&#039;ll get flak for this), I rather like the Wikipedia definition of farce:

&quot;A farce is a comedy written for the stage or film which aims to entertain the audience by means of unlikely, extravagant, and improbable situations, disguise and mistaken identity, verbal humour of varying degrees of sophistication, which may include sexual innuendo and word play, and a fast-paced plot whose speed usually increases, culminating in an ending which often involves an elaborate chase scene. Farce is also characterized by physical humour, the use of deliberate absurdity or nonsense, and broadly stylized performances.

Many farces move at a frantic pace toward the climax, in which the initial problem is resolved one way or another, often through a deus ex machina twist of the plot. Generally, there is a happy ending. The convention of poetic justice is not always observed: The protagonist may get away with what he or she has been trying to hide at all costs, even if it is a criminal act involving crazy costumes.

Farce in general is highly tolerant of transgressive behavior, and tends to depict human beings as vain, irrational, venal, infantile, and prone to automatic behavior. In that respect, farce is a natural companion of satire. Farce is, in fact, not merely a genre but a highly flexible dramatic mode that often occurs in combination with other forms, including romantic comedy. Farce is considered a theatre tradition.&quot;

In fact, history, even in the summarized version that comes down to us, is the exact opposite of farce, which students and people like Morgan (if the quote is correct) accurately note and bewail.

History, as written by good historians, is usually very unlike the above definition of farce. Historians, for example, tend to avoid deus ex machina explanations and Keystone cop chases at the end of their books.

It seems to me that Morgan&#039;s play and Howard&#039;s movie version has many more qualities of a farce (I found the Nixon character sadly farcical compared to the complexity of the real Nixon)than the history contained in the Watergate tapes.

Solipsistic, self-centered cynics, who devalue historical knowledge because it can never be perfect  are ubiquitous. At least they always seem to find me and proceed to annoy. In the Cathedral of Notre Dame de Paris I was once accosted by a fellow tourist while we were inspecting the models of how the church was constructed. He asked me, &quot;How do we know any of this is true and not just all made up.&quot; I was about to get nasty and tell him he should read some books and perhaps even go to look at original documents in Paris libraries and museums when his distraught wife ran up to me and asked me to ignore him, &quot;He&#039;s always like this,&quot; she said. In fact there was no way to give him an education in archeological documentation in five minutes in the half-dark cathedral.

My last point is to draw a comparison.
The world and humans have a history. And our knowledge of that history can be inferred to be imperfect. But what about an individual person. &quot;Know thyself?&quot; Socrates was setting an enormous task, not offering a solution. The Oedipus trilogy was all about individuals not having a clue (or having only a few difficult clues) about their history and the tragedy of that imperfect knowledge. But following some of the clues one can come to some knowledge about oneself. Freud said the same thing. Now neuroscientists are telling us things about the limits of our ability to know things about ourselves, with whom we are ostensibly intimate. For example, that the brain (body) decides to do something before we are consciously aware of a decision. But the brain has the remarkable ability to construct an identity, which is actually a longitudinal memory, or history, that is our working construct of ourselves. Our personal histories are sometimes a farce in the above senses; more often they are serious, incomplete, works in progress, areas of discovery, etc. To throw our individual histories or the human history out the window as totally malleable and useful only in reaching concrete goals (and where do these come from? and where does the language they are couched in come from?) is to engage in the flagrant errors of history-twisters like Stalin or tragically ill schizophrenics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was captured by the alleged quote by Peter Morgan, &#8220;what a complete farce history is.&#8221; </p>
<p>I know how people use the word &#8220;farce&#8221; cynically; I hear it every day. They use it to say, &#8220;there is no such thing as truth.&#8221; Which means, I can do anything, say anything I want to and if I have the power to control the channels of media, it becomes &#8220;truth.&#8221; Plato had a good time with this in one of his dialogues.<br />
But, it seems to me, it is more true that Morgan&#8217;s play and the movie based on it were more accurately farces.<br />
Webster&#8217;s definition of a farce is: to improve as if by stuffing.<br />
Now, Morgan says he cut the parade of jelly-like facts down to the bone. But I would argue he in fact stuffed history with a bunch of crap. The person I was with, for example, walked out of the movie asking, &#8220;What was that girl (Frost&#8217;s friend) there for? She never did anything.&#8221; She was, in fact, a very large bit of well-stuffed stuffing in the form of eye-candy to get some better ratings. </p>
<p>But (and I know I&#8217;ll get flak for this), I rather like the Wikipedia definition of farce:</p>
<p>&#8220;A farce is a comedy written for the stage or film which aims to entertain the audience by means of unlikely, extravagant, and improbable situations, disguise and mistaken identity, verbal humour of varying degrees of sophistication, which may include sexual innuendo and word play, and a fast-paced plot whose speed usually increases, culminating in an ending which often involves an elaborate chase scene. Farce is also characterized by physical humour, the use of deliberate absurdity or nonsense, and broadly stylized performances.</p>
<p>Many farces move at a frantic pace toward the climax, in which the initial problem is resolved one way or another, often through a deus ex machina twist of the plot. Generally, there is a happy ending. The convention of poetic justice is not always observed: The protagonist may get away with what he or she has been trying to hide at all costs, even if it is a criminal act involving crazy costumes.</p>
<p>Farce in general is highly tolerant of transgressive behavior, and tends to depict human beings as vain, irrational, venal, infantile, and prone to automatic behavior. In that respect, farce is a natural companion of satire. Farce is, in fact, not merely a genre but a highly flexible dramatic mode that often occurs in combination with other forms, including romantic comedy. Farce is considered a theatre tradition.&#8221;</p>
<p>In fact, history, even in the summarized version that comes down to us, is the exact opposite of farce, which students and people like Morgan (if the quote is correct) accurately note and bewail.</p>
<p>History, as written by good historians, is usually very unlike the above definition of farce. Historians, for example, tend to avoid deus ex machina explanations and Keystone cop chases at the end of their books.</p>
<p>It seems to me that Morgan&#8217;s play and Howard&#8217;s movie version has many more qualities of a farce (I found the Nixon character sadly farcical compared to the complexity of the real Nixon)than the history contained in the Watergate tapes.</p>
<p>Solipsistic, self-centered cynics, who devalue historical knowledge because it can never be perfect  are ubiquitous. At least they always seem to find me and proceed to annoy. In the Cathedral of Notre Dame de Paris I was once accosted by a fellow tourist while we were inspecting the models of how the church was constructed. He asked me, &#8220;How do we know any of this is true and not just all made up.&#8221; I was about to get nasty and tell him he should read some books and perhaps even go to look at original documents in Paris libraries and museums when his distraught wife ran up to me and asked me to ignore him, &#8220;He&#8217;s always like this,&#8221; she said. In fact there was no way to give him an education in archeological documentation in five minutes in the half-dark cathedral.</p>
<p>My last point is to draw a comparison.<br />
The world and humans have a history. And our knowledge of that history can be inferred to be imperfect. But what about an individual person. &#8220;Know thyself?&#8221; Socrates was setting an enormous task, not offering a solution. The Oedipus trilogy was all about individuals not having a clue (or having only a few difficult clues) about their history and the tragedy of that imperfect knowledge. But following some of the clues one can come to some knowledge about oneself. Freud said the same thing. Now neuroscientists are telling us things about the limits of our ability to know things about ourselves, with whom we are ostensibly intimate. For example, that the brain (body) decides to do something before we are consciously aware of a decision. But the brain has the remarkable ability to construct an identity, which is actually a longitudinal memory, or history, that is our working construct of ourselves. Our personal histories are sometimes a farce in the above senses; more often they are serious, incomplete, works in progress, areas of discovery, etc. To throw our individual histories or the human history out the window as totally malleable and useful only in reaching concrete goals (and where do these come from? and where does the language they are couched in come from?) is to engage in the flagrant errors of history-twisters like Stalin or tragically ill schizophrenics.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Do Republicans Know History Better Than Democrats? by Harlan Lewin</title>
		<link>http://historyintofiction.com/2008/10/do-republicans-know-history-better-than-democrats/comment-page-1/#comment-459</link>
		<dc:creator>Harlan Lewin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 21:54:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://historyintofiction.com/2008/10/do-republicans-know-history-better-than-democrats/#comment-459</guid>
		<description>Boy, do I agree with you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Boy, do I agree with you.</p>
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